I started talking with Elminster this summer over Instagram. We have a number of shared connections and I really appreciate his music (in fact, when he put out a post asking for collaborators on a split I leapt at the chance and sent a submission his way, which I post near the end of this interview). He’s not only a gifted musician, but he’s a Michigan native which I appreciate. He’s very active in the dungeon synth community and he’s extremely supportive of others. His musical career has just started and I anticipate that he will grow and evolve in amazing ways.
I had a predisposition towards liking anyone inspired enough by the character of Elminster that they would name their project after him. I’ve been an avid reader of fantasy and science fiction in my day and I dove headfirst into the Forgotten Realms setting and novels created by Ed Greenwood through my teen years. They contain more substance and charm then the uninitiated might suppose.
I hope you enjoy our conversation as much as I did.
CR:
Could you describe for me the character of Elminster, how you came across him, and what your relationship to the character is?
Elminster:
I first discovered Elminster when I happened upon a small used bookshop in the basement of a Chicago building while I was visiting family at the age of fifteen. I was immediately taken with the cover of the second book in the Elminster series of the Forgotten Realms setting, Elminster in Myth Drannor. I picked up that book and a handful of others and made a point of ordering a copy of the first book in that series, The Making of a Mage. As I began to read it, I experienced an immersion that I haven't had since being a little kid reading Deltora Quest, Harry Potter, The Hobbit, or Eragon. I didn't know it at the time, but something awoke in me the day I cracked TMoaM open in the back of my dad's car for the first time that would eventually lead to me deciding to create a dungeon synth soundtrack to said book 4 years later. For those who are unaware, Elminster is one of the great mages of Faerun and I took an immediate liking to him whilst reading about his childhood antics: being a thief in Hastarl, a brigand in the rolling hills of Athalantar, being transformed into a woman for a time in order to learn about everything involved in that, learning his first magic, and asserting his rightful claim as heir to the throne of athalantar (not exactly in the way the reader initially expects, mind you). In his story, he travels to elven courts, time travels, and a number of other things whilst also being a sassy old man (a favorite literary trope of mine, possibly best exemplified by Zedd in The Sword of Truth, but I digress). As to what Elminster the character means to me, a whole lot. Ed Greenwood has a knack for developing very relatable young adult characters in an extremely vivid, tactile world. I felt much like the awkward, sarcastic El in his coming of age story and the rest, as the saying goes, is history.
CR:
It is a favorite trope of mine as well. I enjoyed the books and read them at about the same age as you did. I was an avid gamer, a pursuit I can't imagine not returning to at some point, and I remember reading Greenwood's articles in Dragon magazine, where Elminster would visit Earth and talk to Ed about this and that while raiding his pantry. I've fallen off reading of his adventures since I was a teen, back in the early nineties, but I retain a fondness for Faerun, it was a refuge for me when I needed one most. I think that, for myself at least, a great deal of my moral center was developed by reading mythology, fantasy, science fiction, and reading as many comics as I could get my hands on through my life. I completely understand your fascination with Elminster, he is an endearing fellow to be sure.
What is your musical background? How did you come upon dungeon synth? I am still relatively new to the idea of dungeon synth and would be interested to know what it means to you and how you would define it.
Elminster:
My musical background is pretty much nonexistent. I took piano lessons for a few months as a kid and learned enough bass to play a house party and jam on dorm floors (I played a mean cover of Angry, Young, and Poor but that's about it). At the beginning of lockdown I began writing some pop punk songs and have about an EPs worth of instrumentals, but nothing I'd call complete. Last summer, I got heavily into Dungeon Synth after hearing the Blood Tower and Apothecarium split when YouTube recommended it to me. I began to become a huge fan of Blood Tower, Balrog, and quite literally any project who still had tapes still in stock. I found Ancient Meadow almost by accident while surfing YouTube via the Stone Dwarf four way split between Coniferous Myst, Owlbear, Scrag, and the Herbalists and put in my first order from them. Barbaric Frost's Against the Darkness was my first tape and I started going for walks every night in the nearest forest as an act of pure escapism. The next tape to arrive was Blood Tower's Clock Dreams. I listened to that album several times the first day I got it while going for marathon forest walks. Later that night, I went home and downloaded Reaper and started staying up until 3:00 or 4:00 am semi-regularly learning how to use it. Everything after that is pretty much history. As to my knowledge of theory, I don't really know any. I usually just pick a key and start trying to find a chord progression. The other way I start a song is by creating a scene in my mind and then ask myself "Alright, what does this sound like" and then start with that. As to what makes something Dungeon Synth, I am going to badly rip off the premise of the video by the youtube channel Innuendo Studios titled Tomatoes, Or How Not To Define Art (if you have a few free minutes, I highly recommend it). In short, when looking to define something, consider a tomato. The botanical definition of a tomato is that it is a fruit, which is true. However, that wouldn't help a chef know what to pair it with. Therefore, a culinary definition of it treats it as a vegetable for the purposes of how it is used in the context of a dish. I find that most art, such as Dungeon Synth, is much the same. The botanical definition would be medieval/fantasy themed dark, ambient music made by the solo project of 90s black metal artists. The culinary definition of Dungeon Synth is whatever you happen to point to when someone asks for an example of Dungeon Synth (this is also a borrowed observation from said video). I sometimes worry that fixation on the inclusion or exclusion of various works within the genre is missing the forest for the trees. The culinary definition that I use is ambient music that promotes escapism and evokes a nostalgia for a time that I was not present for, if it even happened at all.
CR:
Your explanation of what Dungeon Synth is for you is pretty close to what I think about it as well. The traditional definition seems limiting without necessity to me.
I love your lack of musical training. I am in the same boat. I have floundered in deep waters long enough that I have learned to swim, somewhat, but my methods are unorthodox and likely impractical. I treasure the idiosyncratic nature of my creative processes and humbly suggest you lean into yours. At the same time, you may want to learn enough basic theory that you can communicate well with other musicians- you already know it for the most part, even if you aren't aware, but being able to work with others is invaluable. I speak from not having this language at my disposal. I can be frustrating to work with as a result and it has definitely limited me. Advice you didn't ask for, or even probably need, so feel free to ignore it.
It very much sounds as if you were called to create. I know you spoke of the Dungeon Synth influences which brought this about, but what else caused you to actually become what you are now? Why do you think you heard that calling and what compelled you to actually follow it?
Elminster:
You are absolutely right about learning the rudiments of music theory being important. It is one of the many reasons why my collaborations are for the most part limited to doing a split album, which requires only that each artist submit their work, and sending my friends completed tracks for them to solo over. I am slowly absorbing music theory so I can discuss it when working on a project simultaneously with someone else in the room, but it has been slow going. So far, I have only done recording sessions in that style of collaboration with people I have known for awhile and played music with before, because they usually have a decent idea of where I am coming from. Funny this should come up, as I write this I am about to be recording a black metal release with one of my high school best friends, Michael (who has featured on the project before), as soon as he rolls up to the house. In short, you are absolutely right.
In retrospect, I do feel as if I am called to create. I have a hard time being casually into something, I have a compulsive urge to take part. What got me into wanting to make music was hearing the music of JME, a grime rapper from London. One night while skateboarding until 2 AM with my dad during lockdown, I heard his song 96 of My Life and the song Revvin' by Ocean Wisdom. When I got home, I downloaded the trial version of FL Studio and quickly got to work trying to learn to make beats. They were pretty bad and the trial version doesn't let you save the project so I can't hear them. A year and a half later, I am now quite comfortable using that DAW to make drill beats for the Crypt Hop Compilation III and to write an album that I have coming out later this summer out of Hermetic Transmissions. Luke was even kind enough to use one of the tracks in HT's ad for the Dungeon Siege, thanks Luke. Anyways, I'm rambling. I am constantly being inspired to make things. My dad was a big proponent on us kids having hobbies and being a well rounded person and both my parents were nice enough to help us make them happen both in terms of being our quality control and helping us out financially when we were growing up (13 year olds can't really afford Warhammer miniatures out of pocket). Another thing that inspires me are in the studio/"the making of" videos by artists like Jon Bellion and Lauv. On top of that, seeing the output of artists like Davey Sasahara, Adam Matlock, and Izaac Cooper (I think that's Tyrannus' name) is incredibly inspiring.
CR:
What were your musical tastes and influences before your discovery of dungeon synth? I would be curious to know not just conventional influences but also soundtracks or other sources of ambient music that may have caught your attention in the past or present.
Elminster:
My musical taste before Dungeon Synth was fairly varied, but definitely leaned heavy. I enjoyed most/all flavors of punk from hardcore to skate to ska. Metalcore grew on me in late high school and early college with Bring Me The Horizon quickly becoming a favorite due to the diversity of their discography (yes, I am a poser ;p). I had a really fun phase with german hip hop artists Kollegah, Eko Fresh, Bushido, and Shindy when I was an eighth grader. I really like some classics like Nina Simone, Ella Fitzgerald, and Albert Ayler, but I'd be lying if I said I listen with any regularity. I spent some time with electronic music via the Ninety9 Lives mixes and the works of Approaching Nirvana and Midnight Tyrannosaurus. I had mentioned it earlier, but I have an immense appreciation for Ska, particularly Ska Punk. I believe I was at a Mustard Plug show within the first few months of being born and there's even a video of me as a three year old dancing on stage at the annual local ska punk holiday festival, Skannukah. Lastly I have an immense appreciation for singer songwriters such as Damien Rice, Yotam Ben Horen, and (now to alienate everyone lol) Ed Sheeran. To speak more on Ed, I got into him via his more recent work on the divide album but connected more with the tracks off of the multiply, +, no. 5 collaborations, and loose change albums. I feel as though he often gets written off as the guy who wrote photograph, shape of you, and perfect. To those who say that, I would invite them to check out You Need Me, I Don't Need You, Lately (feat. Devlin), and Nina. Those songs and many others that don't get heard as much as I think they deserve are why he is my favorite solo artist.
CR:
Nice! What I enjoy about this list is that so much of it is foreign to me. It is cool when you ask people what they are into and there is a large overlap, but this is a learning opportunity for me. Of these, Albert Ayler is probably my favorite, though I don't listen to him often these days. You have a wide range of interests and plenty to draw upon, which I think is apparent in your music. Thank you for indulging me!
Can you talk about your connection to Fafnir and your Antipaladin project? It is interesting to see you branching into mythology. Are you going to do more projects in this vein? Can you tell me about what we missed on the cassette only bonus track and how your epic finished up?
Elminster:
Certainly, the story behind that album was not as thought out as others. I didn't wake up one morning and go "It's mythology time", the thought grew on me as I was writing Fafnir (which was the third track for that album I wrote). I have always had an interest in mythology that stemmed from stories my grandpa used to tell me on long car drives or when we were spending summer afternoons in his professorial library, stories like How Setanta Got His Name and The Children of Lir. I found the stories of Norse mythology possibly the most interesting due to my interest in the dark forests of Scandinavia and the people that lived there and had read on the topic somewhat whilst in my middle school and teenage years. Back to the story at hand, however. I had been interested in the concept of antipaladins after purchasing some ral partha miniatures of that name for use in my friend group's D&D game at university and figured that a certain sonic quality would lend itself better to an album of that name. I had been growing less and less fond of using orchestral samples the further along I have gotten with writing in the style of dungeon synth. To the unlearned (me), it is incredibly easy to layer and layer only to feel as though your mix is empty compared to fairly minimalist recordings using synths. I put some serious time into finding synth VST patches that didn't sound too corny and would take up an appropriate amount of space. Whilst writing in this style, I got more comfortable using reverbs, delays, saturations, and even took brief dips into step sequencer berlin school inspired interludes and shoegaze FX chains. The more I got to writing, it felt less medieval fantasy and more mythopoetic in nature. While I would keep the moniker of Antipaladin, as it was the spring from which the well sprung, I began to think in terms of myth and legend and less of sword and spell. I also had a selfish desire for there to exist more mythological based albums in the dungeon synth scene that were not pushing a palingenetic ultranationalist agenda, I believe that those projects and artists cause serious harm when listeners begin to develop their identities around them. Out of the swirling fog of all these thoughts, the story of The Death of Fafnir arose. I should also point out that my use of song titles based in that legend were written more referentially than to be listened to as a set in stone soundtrack to that story in the way that The Making Of A Mage was. If the listener desires to use it that way, I am happy they are able to be transported beyond the limits of my original intent. As to doing more projects in this vein, certainly. I have a deep interest in telling the stories of days that never existed. I will most likely focus on the fabled stories of Europe and North America as I feel they fit my songwriting style the best. I would feel bad doing a disrespectful job of covering another region's tales by missing the mark sonically. However, if I do feel that I have progressed well enough as a songwriter to do a faithful telling of the stories of Africa, Australia, Asia, or South America I will certainly attempt it. The cassette bonus track was a piece entitled The Arcane Observatory and in my mind's eye was meant to bring the image of a wizard's astronomy tower observatory, wall tapestries, clock mechanism telescopes, low burning candles, and starry nights. In truth it was included because High Mage asked if I had anything lying around to even up the cassette side length, which I did.
CR:
Great segue for my questions about Mossbridge Mage. Can you talk about that collaboration, what inspired it, and so forth?
Elminster:
In truth, I was shopping for a label to put out Antipaladin. I hadn't been getting much interest but my friend Francis Roberts said that HMP had recently reached out to him about doing a tape for his music. I reached out to HMP and they were immensely kind. As we were getting acquainted, I had mentioned looking at possibly doing some splits this year and they offered to do one with me. I had long been interested in trying out both the concept of recording direct to tape and doing a "live set" so I killed two birds with one stone and took the opportunity to try it out. Material on my side of it ranged from an early demo of the opening track off the new Anadune album to a cover of the Lothlorien theme from the Lord of the Rings.
CR:
You are releasing a lot of music recently. You seem to be pushing your boundaries, which is always cool to see. What are the new projects you are releasing and working on? How do you see your musical expression growing in the future? What are your creative goals or intentions?
Elminster:
Yes, I have! It all started with me getting into drill over Christmas break and deciding to buy FL Studio. From there I slowly began to amass a collection of beats that got released last night under the alias DCCCVIII. Next on the list is The Owl Knight, which I have had in my head as a concept since around October of last year when I read Redwall for the first time. I like the idea of mixing medieval themes with children's story themes and wanted to capture the feeling of childhood adventure via the use of off beat live recording and simple songs. Lastly, I have long wanted to have a Tolkien project and was finally nudged into starting one by agreeing to do the soundtrack for the upcoming Silmarillion mod for Medieval II Total War. I will need to keep a fairly quick pace in order for me to keep pace with the development team, so expect more releases soon (I am on the verge of finishing the second release for that project).
As for upcoming projects, I would like to start taking a look at some historical and semi spiritual themes, these are not yet fleshed out so I won't speculate here.
I was greatly inspired by the output and general sense of "getting down to business" that Davey Sasahara, the artist behind Erythrite Throne has been able to maintain. I decided that I wanted to do something similar but with less of an occult theme and more of a general fantasy theme. I also make this music for myself and I sometimes don't feel like listening to an Elminster style release everyday. For these reasons and more I decided to crank it to 11.
CR:
The nice thing about cranking up the intensity is you can always bring it back down, and vice versa. What a great soundtrack for you to be working on~ I think you're a great fit for that kind of work. I think having a project that is so focused and ambitious is also a brilliant way to challenge yourself. I look forward to hearing more of it!
What have I missed about you, I wonder? When you're talking with people about yourself and your music, what do you think they are missing as they are trying to get at what really motivates you to create the works that you do? I am grateful for all that you have shared, but I wonder if there are parts that we have only just touched upon which you think should be fleshed out more.
I also notice that, when you release music, you consistently offer thanks to your parents and others for supporting you. I'm sure this is just part of who you are and something you think isn't a big deal, but I feel like it says a lot about you.
Elminster:
I like to think that I mostly wear my heart on my sleeve with my projects, the only reason that the public wouldn't know the answer to a question they had about me/my music is if they didn't ask. As to what motivates me, I write music as much for me as I do for others. When I write, I really am more trying to capture the feelings I experience when engaging with the material that inspires me than I am trying to make music that just sounds nice. For example, MIDIeval was objectively better written, produced, etc. than The Making Of A Mage, but I put so much more of my soul into The Making Of A Mage because I made it as a soundtrack for my favorite fantasy novel. As far as the symbolism and meaning to me in each, MIDIeval is a doodle in your calculus notebook while The Making Of A Mage is a fresco in cathedral, so to speak.
Of course I want to thank them! I have been lucky enough to have parents who are proud of the fact that I have interests and actively worked to cultivate them as I grew up. They are always willing to help me by listening to demos and offering feedback or, in my dad's case, giving me the instruments I needed to get started in music. On top of that, I have a wonderful girlfriend, Tori, who understands that Dungeon Synth in particular, and music in general means so much to me. Her willingness to both respect the free time that I spend making music and her excitement when I tell her about milestones is, in part, why I stay so motivated to keep creating. Lastly, most, if not all my albums are/will be dedicated to my late grandpa, who we affectionately called Bump while growing up. He and I were best friends and he passed away in November of 2019. I think of him as often as I am able to.
CR:
You definitely come across as a genuine person which I more than appreciate~ I think that is even evident in your music, but especially in our correspondences in this interview and outside of it. I really appreciate your time. I know I am a relative newb in the Dungeon Synth community, but I see how involved you are and supportive of others.
Elminster:
Thank you for interviewing me! My music can be found at elminster.bandcamp.com. I have begun having certain tape releases be bundled with a charity donation program for the proceeds. If you, the reader, see one of these releases, please consider donating! High Mage and I put together some donations for domestic violence shelters and I have some plans for wildlife preservation charities in the future for a TBA release if either of these are of interest.
Stay safe and love each other.
I wanted to share the split that Elminster graciously put together with me, put together after we finished up the interview but before I had time to post our conversation:
To close out this post, I want to acknowledge and sing the praises of David Loveless, who also recently interviewed Elminster. I encourage you to check it out and read more about Elminster and his projects. You should also check out the rest of the content on his website, which is an amazing and inspiring resource.
Here is a direct link to his site;
https://thedungeonindeepspace.com/
and all of his other links as well;
and last but not least, you should also check out David’s music: